Speak Out Loud NA

Thursday, May 26, 2005

Roger and Laura Continue Debate

From Roger: Laura
The floodgates of reasoned discourse certainly opened when you enabled anonymity on your blog.
I'm not sure whether it is sociology or psychology, but perhaps you can enlighten me as to the dynamic of the mob. I seem to recall that this is the theory of individuals being restrained by custom and upbringing, but when part of a group, and yes, anonymous in the crowd, they find it much easier to do things they would never consider while alone.
Just curious.
One more thing. Will you follow through and add me to the list of contributors, or do you intend to throw some red meat out to the mob and silence me? They'd certainly appreciate it. Already one - didn't catch the name - has suggested I go home to my rag. I'm really quite hurt by such anonymous sentiments, but whatever; I also understand perfectly well that you could be quite the hero to these people by doing a bit of muzzling of your own.
Food for thought, as it were.
Roger

From Laura: Roger,

I apologize for the tardy response, but I have had more pressing matters at hand as of late. But, I will now attempt to address your curiousness.
First:
Yep, it's open season for hunting down the facts of an administration gone awry. The only way to get the facts presented to the public is to allow anonymous comments from the folks that have these facts, but until now have had no opportunity, or avenue by which to make ALL the information public knowledge. Since I, and many others, feel it imperative to have all the facts before a true conclusion can be drawn on any matter, I stand by my decision.
I have repeatedly read that the budget "fix" was supported, at least in part, because it was the only "fix" being presented, and nobody else had presented another alternative.
Indeed! How might one go about such a task when the information is not available to the general public?
I personally sat through hours of budgetary hearings last year, when no public comments or questions were allowed, but it was an open public meeting. There were precious few of us there, and although we've never met, I do not believe, by description, that you attended these hearings, where every department head made their plea for a larger cut of the pie.
At the time, I did ask Kay Garry for a copy of the budget proposal that the council was pondering, and was promptly told "no". No member of the public was allowed to see the budget proposal until after it was to be submitted and returned from State officials.
Now I ask you, how might anyone outside of City government have the information necessary to accurately debate if there might be a better alternative or not?
As we heard at the last council meeting, there is still $65K sitting in the Building Commissioners budget for employees that no longer exist (example).
As to your "mob mentality theory", yes this is a sociological dynamic, but I contend that you are misguided in its use. You see, people lose their inhibitions and act out in unacceptable social manners when they are actually IN a mob (physically) that has escalated into a frenzy of actions and emotions. This stimulus has a psychological impact that reduces or eliminates the perceived notion of personal responsibility of ACTIONS.
I don't believe this theory is applicable to someone sitting alone at their computer simply reading other peoples opinions, and knowing that they will suffer no repercussions by offering up what opinion or information they may have to this discourse.
As to your hurt feelings, well I suggest you reconsider some of the name calling you threw around (cowardly), and the presumptions you made regarding anonymity (tantamount to vandalism?!), as well as your predetermination that all forthcoming comments would be nothing more than "gibberish" and "anti-social blathering". Do you think hurling such comments are less hurtful than one who suggested you "return to your rag".
However, if you have read my postings carefully, you will find that I have warned of inappropriate comments or slander and that I do retain editorial control and will not allow this opportunity to be abused or misused by ANYONE, anonymous or not.
Finally, I applaud your venture into the realm of civic activism, and look forward to more thoughtful exchanges with you. I believe such activism (on everyone's part) is long overdue in New Albany. But, I certainly do not endorse any of the hurtful comments (from either side), and hope that you will continue to contribute to these lively, healthy, and informational, debates with appropriate respect. You are welcomed on the Speak Out Loud NA blog as always.
After all, as you stated, this is too much fun to stop now.
I wish you continued success.
Sincerely,
Laura Oates

130 Comments:

  • I disagree with your assessment that mob mentality doesn't apply to an online environment, especially when dealing with anonymity. I've particiapted in online virtual communities for over 10 years, and took some courses back in my college days on small group communication with topics dealing specifically on how online anonymity, when in the hands of the immature, can be a very destructive force.

    For a great article on how the anonymity of the Internet can be a destructive force in online social communities (such as blogs, forums, MUDs, etc), see this article by Julian Dibbell:

    http://www.juliandibbell.com/texts/bungle.html

    By Blogger TSOLfan, at 4:29 PM, May 26, 2005  

  • Once again, I will not allow outright rudeness on this blog.
    I do not consider criticizing grammer skills to be constructive dialouge.

    By Blogger East Ender, at 3:16 AM, May 27, 2005  

  • grammar
    dialogue

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 10:58 AM, May 27, 2005  

  • When you see New Albanian listed as a contributor to this site, then you'll know that Laura has followed through with her previously stated commitment to free speech.

    Until then ...

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 11:27 AM, May 27, 2005  

  • To Anonymous...my point exactly.

    To the new albanian...you have an open invitation sitting in the "members" list. All you have to do is accept, and you will become a member.

    By Blogger East Ender, at 11:41 AM, May 27, 2005  

  • This is not a right or wrong issue. It appears to me-the new albanian. You don't agree with Laura. But you fail to realize people in New Albany need to be informed. This blog is open to Freedom Of Speech. What is your problem with Constructive Dialouge. Grammar-please don't even go there. I will say you do not agree with my comments. And I can say after reading you "blog", and comments me and you will never agree. So let's move on and you need to get pass this argument with laura. This is "Her blog" and she allows people to say how they feel. And what there concerns are. With or without using names. I feel everyones VOICE matters.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 1:01 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • I might not make over $25,000 year. But I do pay my taxes. I see so many needs for this town. Street's,abdoned cars.delaped houses. Empty Boarded up store fronts? Pot holes.We spent all them millions of dollars for the new Firehouse on spring. And tore the one down on main? Were is all our Tax Dollars being used for? I want my voice heard.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 1:10 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • TIF AND TAX AND TIC-TAC-TOE: Yes, I am trying to be funny, but that seems to be the way this admininstration is playing with our tax dollars. I try to be a nice guy. I go in and pay my property taxes twice a year on time. WOW--have I been in the dark on City finances? We need to know the facts. Thank you, Thank you Laura, for allowing us to comment and to be able to ask questions. Laura you are doing a great community service.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 1:47 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • TIF AREAS: I keep hearing about Tif areas in New Albany, and I asked about how many of these TIF circles on the map we have in New Albany. These are supposed to be the areas where the TAX Dollars stay in that circle. My question is: How many TIF circle areas do we have in New Albany? And what amount of dolls of prperty tax money is going into those TIF pots and not helping the General Fund to support the City Budget and thus help keep our property tax bills down?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 2:01 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • My concerns is higher taxes. Higher sewer Bills. And higher water bills? I do not feel I am getting "The big Bang for my buck".

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 2:05 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • My wife and I was at the city council meeting Over Scribner place couple years ago. If my memory serves me right. our current mayor voted against it? With higher gas for us to go to work. Higher property taxes. Where does the average family suppose to pull additional funds? We live pay check to paycheck.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 2:14 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • Is the Mayor's suv leased or bought? My counsin on the New Albany Fire Dept. says it was paid for out of Fire Dept. money? Isn't that taking money away from our Fire Dept? And is this standard policy? Is there not a budget for each Department?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 2:25 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • Tax Increment Finance areas-----I saw the question about how many TIF areas set are up in the City of New Albany. If you check the records in City-County Bldg, you will find that we had 5 TIF areas and then 3 more added to these areas. If my math is right we have 5 + 3 = 8 TIF areas. The explanation that you will get on the last 3 TIFS is that, "Oh, well, we just extended the boundries of the first 5 TIF areas."
    The person who mentioned TIF earlier is correct, the new property tax collected in TIF areas does not go toward helping the City Budget or to help keep our taxes down.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 2:39 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • Compliments and appreciation to Laura:

    Laura: You are making me feel like a citizen in the land of the free! Your efforts to allow citizens to speak up and to ask questions is great. We, the people, need to learn more about the City of New Albany and how our tax money is being spent. Your efforts are patriotic!
    FOR THE PEOPLE, BY THE PEOPLE IN THE LAND OF LIBERTY. Laura, you are waving the flag for us. Hang in there!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 2:50 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • Let's go with a positive note. This Memorial Day. Let's show are Support For Our-New Albany Police and Fire Dept. By placing an American flag. No matter how big or small. In your front yard, to show much needed support. And the appreciation they deserve. And pray for the men and women serving the Good Ole USA. Speak Out Loud NA-Let Our Voices Be Heard!!

    By Blogger One voice, at 2:51 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • We don't want to be attacked. For what we think. Isn't "THIS WHAT THIS GREAT COUNTRY IS ALL ABOUT". I go to work. I Pay my taxes. We want to hear the good and bad news in New Albany. Don't try to sugar coat it. Surely someone know's the truth. Because I don't feel were getting the truth. Great job Laura.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 3:07 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • Laura don't let the new albanian, Scream Free Speech. That would be like throwing him into "Attack-Attack-Dialogue mode. As we all have already read. He's right and were wrong. So we all rise above his cheap shots. And write our concerns and information. And be Proud We our the people of New Albany. I do not support Scribner Place. I think people need to stop beating up Our Council...Let them Do the Job we pay them to do.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 3:27 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • Thanks Anonymous for the TIF Information-See 2 anonymous people can ask and answer logical questions.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 3:42 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • Question- Why is there 38 Accounts foe Sewers? I heard mrs. Garry say that? can someone explain?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 4:01 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • Great job east ender!!!!!! We totally support your comments...Freedom Of Speech!!!!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 4:13 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • Anyone know where "ConcernedTaxPayer" has been?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 4:19 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • Always enjoyed Concern Taxpayer's comments. Very imformative. Great job Concern Taxpayer. You handled Roger well. Regardless of being (deleated). Freedom Of Speech-Concern Taxpayer...

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 4:36 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • Can anyone confirm about the investigation on Tom Cannon's office?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 4:44 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • Someone better be able to confirm or hometowngirl could be facing legal action for what was terribly irresponsible behavior.

    By Blogger Jeff Gillenwater, at 5:19 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • Bluegill, that's the whole idea, isn't it? Anonymity means never having to say you're responsible for libelous or slanderous remarks.

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 5:50 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • True enough.

    I suppose that's what IP numbers, MAC IDs and subpoenas are for, though.

    By Blogger Jeff Gillenwater, at 5:58 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • If I could make a reply to the new albanian and bluegill? a few weeks ago there was an article in the newspaper concerning an investigation? Mr. Baylor please step off your soapbox. Laura out of the deepest respect for your hard work and defending what you believe in. And giving the taxpayers and people of New Albany a chance to talk and ask questions. I truly think there is somethings that need to be said. As I wrote on your blog. And you deleted. Which is your right. I now want to bring it to laura and other people of New Albany "ATTENTION"..I was at the meeting to hear Steve price speak. So in my search to make sense of one day were broke? Next day everything is political? People supposely going to loose there job. I have known Mr. & Mrs. Bill Schmidt over 20 years. Mrs. Schmidt approached Mr. Baylor in nothing less than the refine lady she truly is. And said to Mr. Baylor very Politely- These are the facts and figures. "YOUR REPLY MR. BAYLOR" was I am not interested in your facts? I have talk to Mrs. Schmidt regarding this. And laura feel free to call Mrs. Schmidt. I ask you to oplogize to Mrs. Schmidt. Eveeryone has something to say. Why do you refuse to sit there with a closed mind? people have been lied to about our town? We only want the truth. And apparently you have such a hang up with "Anonmity" ..We hear you. You said you piece. Let's have logical dialogue. Instead of attacking Laura, Mrs. Anna Schmidt, Valla Ann, Huckleberry,Steve Price. And a long list of others. As Laura stated-Enough is Enough...You fling "Constructive Dialogue". Anyone interested you can contact Mrs. Anna Schmidt. And she can verify my printed comments.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 11:28 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • Welcome to freedom of speech.......you sure have been missed! HomeTownGirl

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 11:37 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • I was also at that meeting. And heard this "conversation" -Concern Taxpayer. And I also contacted Mrs. Schmidt. This is "WHAT fREEDOM Of SPEECH" is all about. But being rude. Calling people cowards is not the answer. People want to be a part of this Town. Regardless if you make $20,000 or $100,000 Year. We are the people. We want to heard. And we want answers......

    By Blogger One voice, at 11:48 PM, May 27, 2005  

  • Respect is earned not demanded. I feel anyone writing on this blog has a right to disagree. My concern is our Sewers being fixed. And making sure all Departments are covered. We have enough Police. Fireman. People can not do there job with out having the proper tools. I say trim the budget to the bare bone. To get thru this crisis.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 12:01 AM, May 28, 2005  

  • Well Concern Taxpayer: Based on my Legal Knowledge you have not broken any laws with your comments. Great Job Concern Taxpayer. I also know the Schmidt Family. There is not a finer man than Bill Schmidt. Again I Do Stress,everyone has a right to say what they feel. I am a big supporter of the FOP. We need to make sure that they have every protection that they need. The streets in New Albany is the biggest mess I have ever seen. And hearing about the injuries to the Street department employees.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 12:19 AM, May 28, 2005  

  • You can not be "SUED" for asking questions about an investigation.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 12:31 AM, May 28, 2005  

  • Did anyone read Saturday May 28- New Albany Tribune - City Official Considering Legal Action After Accusations. Garner said- "This is a Salem witchhunt in New Albany." let's discuss this issue. Any comments-Concerning Freedom Of Speech.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 8:00 PM, May 28, 2005  

  • A few weeks back on my Blog, CONCERN TAXPAYER told a lie about me. He or she would not respond to my request to correct the mistruth, so I removed his or her posting privileges.

    Do all of you agree that free speech does not include the freedom to commit outright falsehood? Let's hear the anguished cries of "repression" when someone anonymous decides to lie about you and the refuses to acknowledge it or correct the mistruth.

    Even Tim Deatrick, with whom I disagree most of the time, will agree that when there was a question about what Tim said at the Council meeting and how it was inaccurately reported in NAC, I pursued the matter, corrected the mistake, and Tim was offered an apology.

    With respect to my conversation with Anna Schmidt after the S. Ellen meeting, I would have given my side publicly on Confidential had it not been the case that not one, but two anonymous poster brought it up, and misrepresented it, probably because at least one of them wasn't even there at the time.

    After the meeting, Mrs. Schmidt approached me and asked me if I understood that her purpose was not to advocate one political position or another, but to identify the numbers.

    I told her that I admired her ability to undertake such missions, because math never was my favored subject, and that I am less interested in raw numbers than I am in the broader personal motivations present in local affairs.

    I was smiling, she was smiling, and at no time were rude words spoken, nor did I say anything remotely suggesting that I don't care about "facts." The topic was numbers, not facts.

    My point was, and is, that both numbers and facts can be in the eye of the beholder.

    Furthermore, at no time in the history of NA Confidential have I said anything rude against either of the Schmidts, other than to use the word "disappointment" to describe Bill Schmidt's recent votes, because I disagree with the votes.

    If anyone wishes to make more of this conversation than was there, I can't stop you from doing so. But be aware that you are not being factual when you do so.

    And, if in fact this anonymous Concern Taxpayer is the same Concern Taxpayer as before on my blog, then he or she already has lied once about me ... so how am I to know you haven't done it again?

    If you've made it this far, then take note: Concern Taxpayer is anonymous, and has lied twice about me. I'm not anonymous at all, and have been lied about twice. All who profess to fairness and free speech: What's so fair and free about that? Is that the way you personally want to be treated?

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 8:15 PM, May 28, 2005  

  • As stated before. I was there. and heard you tell Mrs. Schmidt You Were Not Interested in Her Facts. And Mr Baylor-"YOU WERE VERY RUDE". You can "SUGAR COAT IT ALL YOU WANT." And try to justify your actions. But sell it to someone else. I have read Concern Taxpayers comments in the past on your blog. So comtinue to attack-attack- all you want. But this blog belongs to the people of New Albany.. Laura respects various ideas. Since you have all the answers? And every one else is wrong and your right. Why argue with you.

    By Blogger One voice, at 11:29 PM, May 28, 2005  

  • I was there, too, and I quite plainly told her that I respected her for her patience with numbers, while pointing out that my interests lie elsewhere.

    The word "fact" was not mentioned by me, because to use the word "fact" would indicate that I approve of her method of calculation, and this is a stamp of approval that I'm not willing to offer.

    Disagreement is disagreement, and it's certainly understandable for you to disagree with me, but it's simply wrong to continue this misrepresentation of my demeanor.

    Once again, I urge you to read what I've written.

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 11:46 PM, May 28, 2005  

  • City Official Considering Legal Action After Accusations- Under the First Amendment of the United States Constitution,as set forth by the U.S.Supreme Court in the 1964 Case, New York Times v Sullivan, where a public figure attempts to bring an action for defamation,the public figure must prove an additional element: That the statement was made with 'actual malice" In translation,that means that the person making the statement knew the statement to be false,or issued the statement with reckless disregard as to its truth. This might help several people understand alittle more after reading this dumb article. I personally don't know Ms. Valla Ann Bolovschak. But I totally feel she has been accused unfairly. I am sure her attorney's is laughing at this article. Like I did when I read it. I have heard her speak at a few Council Meetings. And I have to say. I was very Impressed with her Questions and Comments.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 12:25 AM, May 29, 2005  

  • You made New Albany history that night at The City Council Meeting when you pointed your finger and said- Jimmy You Work For Me. I can not express My Thanks to you for representing us Taxpayers. I truly felt you were speaking for me and my family. Thank you again Ms. Bolovschak.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 12:48 AM, May 29, 2005  

  • Our office manager at work had been to that Council Meeting that night also. And you was the talk of our office. Today when the paper was delivered. We all were totally outraged at the article. We Support you Ms. Valla Ann Bolovschak. Keep standing up for us.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 12:58 AM, May 29, 2005  

  • Let the investigation begin, the people of NewAlbany want nothing more but to grow .....If it takes Ms.Bolovschak to step forward because no one else has the guts then bring it on, my hats off to her, we need more people such as her in this town..
    HomeTownGirl

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 1:01 AM, May 29, 2005  

  • We Support You-Ms Valla Ann. Don't back down from this Adminstration. We need you to be OUR VOICE. Great Job. Freedom Of Speech.......

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 1:03 AM, May 29, 2005  

  • We need more Women like you in office. Give them hell Ms Bolovschak. Don't back down when you got the truth/facts on your side.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 2:06 AM, May 29, 2005  

  • This is a political ploy to take the spot light away from possiable mismanagement of our money. It is a sad day in New Albany that Ms. Valla Ann Bolovschak is being attacked. And made out to be the escape goat. She has not been nothing but an outstanding citizen for New Albany.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 2:16 AM, May 29, 2005  

  • Bring this investigation on? She is a Taxpayer like the rest of us. She also supports many Projects. To attack this Honest Hardworking Business Women is a shame. She has alot to say. And let her speak. Shame on everyone involved. You call this a Salem Witch Hunt?..I call this political disgrace. You have my support Ms.Valla Ann Bolovschak

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 2:49 AM, May 29, 2005  

  • Jimmy G. You Work For Me Too. I write your paycheck every Two Weeks. And still you don't know me. I cut my grass. I pay my Water Bill, and Sewer Bill. I go to work everyday. And I help my neighbors. I go to The City Council Meetings. I pay my share. But you still don't know me. I am a Taxpayer. "And you do" work for me!!!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 3:38 AM, May 29, 2005  

  • A Republican (Bolovschak) with mayoral ambitions unites with a couple of terminally dissaffected Democrats to disrupt city operations through accusations.

    Heroic? Perhaps. Politics? You be the judge.

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 9:23 AM, May 29, 2005  

  • She has a right to be heard like the rest of us. Regardless if she is a democrat or a republican. Me and my wife was sitting there and listen to her questions and concerns. At the last council meeting. Ms. Bolovschak We liked what we heard. She made alot of valid points. And ask alot of great questions. Someone needs to ask the tough questions. She speaks for alot of us people. To attack her like this outrage.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 10:28 AM, May 29, 2005  

  • Ms.Valla Ann Bolovschak: You are truly a fresh breeze in this town. We need more people like yourself to stand up to this Adminstration. And ask for accountiability! You want the same answers my family does. Difference is you got the guts to ask the hard questions. We support you!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 10:40 AM, May 29, 2005  

  • I support a "Investigation"...So bring suit against me too. We Support you Ms. Bolovschak. Were getting tired of being lied to.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 10:49 AM, May 29, 2005  

  • You damn right! Jimmy you do also work for my family. Stop attacking this women. If you spent as much time on the business of New Albany. And stop trying to blame others. We might get some real business done.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 10:55 AM, May 29, 2005  

  • I agree with you Legalbeagle. This article has no merit. This is what Freedom Of Speech is about. Someone needs to ask the Questions. Being borned and raised in our town. I also support a Investigation. Are they now going to blame Ms. Valla Ann Bolovschak for this mess? I truly think we need some answers. You got mY vOTE and SUPPORT!

    By Blogger One voice, at 11:05 AM, May 29, 2005  

  • the new albanian: You sure don't know much. Yell we all left your "blog" because of your attacks. So how many City Council Meeting do you stand up and Speak? And ask the hard questions? How many Sewer Board Meeting do you attend? And take notes and speak?How many County Council Meetings you attend? And take notes and ask Questions? And speak? I think you mention you lived in the County. There's Alot more terminally Disaffected Democrats & Republicans then just a few. Maybe you need to contact Ms.Valla Ann Bolovschak and get your fact right. Besides Ms. Valla Ann Bolovschak could "Teach you Proper Grammar,as well as manners. Cause you also need a "crash course" given to you in Public Speaking. I personally think Ms.Bolovschak does an Excellent job. She has my support.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 11:32 AM, May 29, 2005  

  • She is First Class all the way. Besides that she doesn't own a poodle. Like you imply. GO VALLA ANN!!!!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 11:36 AM, May 29, 2005  

  • Ms. Bolovschak is an outstanding citizen of New Albany. Her Bed & Breakfast brings alot of business to our small town. This is just a bunch of jealous -good ole Boys, trying to blame her. Because she stands up for reasoning. And presents facts. And ask Questions. Shame on all of you.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 11:48 AM, May 29, 2005  

  • CITY FINANCIAL INVESTIGATION: Ms. Valla Ann Bolovschak who is a New Albany taxpayer,made a speech at the last City Council meeting. MS. Bolovschak questioned some of Mayor Garner"s current accounting actions and expenditures out of some funds. MS. Bolovschak read information from the State laws that should be followed. Ms. Bolovschak said that she had talked with local prosecutor and his office would investigate the matter if the City Council made a motion to review the accounting of the city. The City Council members all just sat there and listened and some said nothing. Only Councilman Schmidt and Councilman Price had the courage to make a motion and to second the motion to request the review of the financial matters being question by the taxpayers. If all of the accounting practices are approved, then it could be a compliment to the city. The "kicker"was that Council President Jeff Gahan would not allow the motion to be voted on. WHY--Mr.Gahan? So Ms. Valla Ann Bolovschak, I say to you "EXCELLENT JOB". You must of hit a raw nerve? You have the Courage,Guts,Backbone,Facts to stand up to this Adminstration and ask the Right Questions. It seems like to me when Politicians in New Albany hear the words "LOCAL PROSECUTOR" they seem to play the blame game. Maybe it is true Ms. Bolovschak. "When there is smoke there is Fire."

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 12:30 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • Great job concern taxpayer. Have you any idea who can put out this fire? Seems like to me there is alot of questions needed answering?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 12:38 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • Accusing someone of a crime when it is known to be a false accusation meets the standards of the Sullivan case. Lawyers will decide it, but actual malice (a legal term) and actual malice (a societal standard for conduct) meet right at the lips of Valla Ann Bolovschak.

    Like the lady. Despise her conduct. She brings nothing constructive to the debate. She's a grandstanding politician trying to bootstrap a campaign with the support of people willing to believe anything.

    Find the facts before you speak, people.

    Let's see her lay out her facts on this blog and sign her name to it. Her lawyers won't let her.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 12:39 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • GO Valla Ann- You got the offices in The City County Building buzzin. Seems like you ruffled several feathers.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 12:46 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • Cant we start raising money for Vallan to run for mayor. Luara could you give us your address so we can send checks?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 12:49 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • Anonymous- Do you not realize. She pays to have Council Meetings taped.With Her own money not yours. Council meetings on WNAS.I think legalbeagle hit the nail on the head. No merit. Smells like smoke in the Mayor's Office. Thanks for your comments. Tell Baylor hi for all of us.

    By Blogger One voice, at 1:00 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • ATTACK-ATTACK-ATTACK-ATTACK!!!!! Don't know about the rest of you. But I'd put my money On Ms. Bolovschak anyday. Malice: No bases. In fact- they need to bring sued against everyone who doesn't agree.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 1:13 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • Valla Ann is a good friend of mine. I speak with her on a daily basis, and I can attest to her honest motives in exposing the misconduct that is rampant in our city government, beginning at the top.

    Don't be put off by the statements that her actions are politically motivated by a desire to run for mayor. It simply is not true.

    By Blogger Ann, at 1:49 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • Expose?

    Where? We await this "exposure." What does Valla Ann know that she refuses to share with us?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 1:59 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • I can't afford cable TV. How can I see these tapes Valla Ann pays for?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 2:01 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • Concern Taxpayer says that the council should ignore parliamentary procedure when it suits the dictates of his or her witch-hunt.

    May we take this a step further and ask which parts of the Bill of Rights should be suspended when it suits his or her current whim?

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 2:42 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • I forgot: Concern Taxpayer, can you say hi to NA Resident for me?

    I may not know who you are, but somehow I get the impression that you know each other.

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 2:43 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • Im laughing as i read every one of these comments, i know most of these people who place them.......I can only say this GO Vallann! I also must give thanks to Laura , you sure have done something great for the citizens, Maybe some of you can laugh with me when i read Baylor's comment(attacks) reminds me of a school girl who has gotten her dress dirty.....finally this town has someone who can ask the questions with no motive but getting the facts , truth, and action NOW...Vallann , great job, please keep asking those right questions
    HomeTownGirl

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 3:56 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • the new albanian- You need to reread The Bill OF Rights? But since your the only one in New Albany that is right. Since You have a plan to save New Albany. AND SOLVE "World Peace". End of conversation.. "Have a great day Baylor!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 3:59 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • Ms.Vallann doesnt want to be Mayor...Baylor i gather you like to read may i suggestlearning to make friends and Influencing bloggers...regardless what lies you say and print I support Ms.Bolovschak........

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 4:09 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • I know Ms.Vallann.......I know fact is she says something you can bet that you can take it to the bank!Theres not but a few i can say that for.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 4:13 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • Saying the "Garry Plan" is the best plan since it is the only one presented is like saying The Tribune is the best paper because it's the only one from New Albany.

    Anonymous, I have to chuckle along with you. I remember when Mayor Garner was just a discombobulated pixie on Zoloft.

    You can be sure that Valla Ann has her documentation all lined up--more documentation that you can imagine. Let's just say that I believe the future will be very revealing.

    By Blogger Ann, at 4:25 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • . . . I meant to say, more documentation THAN you can imagine.

    By Blogger Ann, at 4:30 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • new alb annie: I am outraged by the Attacks on Ms.Bolovschak. This women is such an Inspiration to us all. Finally we can have someone speak for us. She speaks in a manner everyone can understand. With dignity and Grace. The citizens should be upset. No one will give us the straight truth. Thank You, Ms.Valla Ann Bolovschak for making us see this is a bigger problem then were being told.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 5:39 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • I'm very glad New Alb Annie brought it up.

    Indeed, you're not the only ones laughing today.

    Permit me to explain and to answer New Alb Annie, at least until Laura deletes this one, too.

    As many of you are proving on a daily basis, it's easier to talk big when you're anonymous.

    And, as I've learned, it's harder to admit you've been wrong when your big-talking errors were committed with your real name right alongside them for everyone to see.

    Once upon a time, I wrote some fairly nasty things about the Mayor, and when I did, not only did I do so without the anonymity you all think (wrongly) is necessary for free speech, but what's more, several of you thought I was the bee's knees.

    You slapped my back and shook my hand. I know it was sincere, and I'm not mocking you for it, but as soon as it became apparent that I wouldn't be so easily led, boy, you dropped me like a hot potato.

    Well, for what it's worth, my changing my mind was sincere, and my positions remain sincere. But since our positions no longer mesh, I get to be a whipping boy.

    Cool. What you don't seem to get is how much I enjoy such a role.

    It especially amuses me that now, you just can't figure out what happened, because in the limited range of your black and white worlds, it is inconceivable that someone would examine his or her beliefs and find them wanting. Above all else, consistency and predictablilty are valued.

    My "betrayal" can't possibly be explained except through bribery or corruption. Was I bought off? Did the great conspiratorial Garnerist machine threaten me, pay me off, suck me in?

    Really, must everything be like it is in comic books and bad movies?

    Folks, there's a considerable difference between bad acting and outright venality. Politics certainly blurs this distinction, but it remains valid.

    It's easy to support the only plan on the table when the alternative is allowing power to rest in the hands of people who are openly opposed to progress, whose knee-jerk reaction against progress is best expressed by the attitude that the city can perfectly well remain third-rate, and that growth can be measured only by the money we have now, ruling out progressive revenue enhancement of any form.

    That'd be the right side of the council table.

    It's a shame we've gotten along so badly, because if we were ever able to have a genuine discussion, as opposed to the mud pie throwing that passes for discussion here, it would be revealed that most of us, even me, share beliefs and agree that the previous models of government and economy haven't worked.

    We differ in how the future should proceed, and in spite of what Tim and others will say, my blog has been filled with posts by myself and many others, many of which provide ideas for the future that represent a departure from the failed politics of the past.

    It's not just this administration or that one, this council or that one. It's systemic, and we must change the value system underlying it. This change has nothing to do with the politicians currently in office.

    It has to do with the voters, with the residents, with the people. Ordinance enforcement, to name one, is part of this.

    I, too, want to live in a place where fear, paranoia, misinformation and petty grievances can be pushed aside in favor of growth and progress.

    You may resume firing.

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 7:50 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • Baylor, I find it amusing that you feel the need to justify your words. In case you haven't noticed, people are tired of playing on your soapbox and have moved on to this one. It nice to be able to have a thought process and not be criticized for it

    In the case of Valla Ann ... I do believe a nerve was hit. It takes a big man to attack a 70 year old lady and call a valid question a salem witch hunt in new albany

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 10:08 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • Posters being carried in front of the Court House say the GARRY PLAN for the
    city finances. The newspaper says the
    GARRY PLAN. Why doesn't the Mayor stand on his own two feet and call his plan for
    City Finances the Garner Plan.? Mrs. Garry seems very frustrated by this
    situation as her name is being used.
    It should be called the GARNER PLAN.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 10:53 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • I didn't get a response the first time so I'll ask again:

    How did anonymous above or anyone decide that what Valla Ann said is valid or credible?

    I'm not saying it is or isn't. I just can't figure out why people on this blog is showing her so much support for having said something but there's not much talk about what she actually said and/or if it's true. So far nobody that I've read has said "I think it's true because..."

    Why do you think Schmidt and Price made and seconded the motion without asking any questions whatsoever? Doesn't it seem strange that two council members would so quickly support an investigation that would undoubtedly cost the city a lot of money and lost productivity without at least asking a couple of questions first?

    Also, someone above made a comment that it was good to finally have someone speaking for us. Why do you or anyone else need someone to speak for you?

    What's wrong with speaking for yourself?

    By Blogger Jeff Gillenwater, at 11:44 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • Your personal attack on Valla Ann Bolovschak is UNCALLED FOR! Your so called blog. Tries to humilate her and others. You say Bolovschakite? How disrespectful you are. What this women has done for this city is honorable. Believe me she doesn't have to run for Mayor to get or make things happen! She doesn't have to Bull-shit nobody. MS. Bolovachak Shoots straight from the hip. It offends my family to see this being done to her. This whole town needs investigated. This young women has earned MY RESPECT!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 11:51 PM, May 29, 2005  

  • I can speak for myself. I support Valla Ann Bolovschak. I have heard her 2 times at council. Even though it seems to me she makes them very nervous when she walks up to speak. This women is looking out for the people of New Albany. She does not talk down to people. She does not disrespect the council. She does not agree and support the current Administration on all points. Listening to her speak-says volumes about her.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 12:05 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • I totally support MS. Bolovschak. She can speak for me and my family anyday. What she says in 5 minutes would take me and hour to say. She can present point by point. She sugar coats nothing. in her speech you see the details and logic. I feel this Adminstration has made a serious mistake ATTACKING HER! And this does not set well with me.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 12:18 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • Thanks for the responses folks but what you seem to be saying is that you support her based on how she says things rather than what she says.

    I certainly appreciate logical thought and speaking ability. In fact, I'm disappointed with my council member because he doesn't seem to have those traits.

    But, again, WHAT does she say that you agree with? When she spoke about the investigation, did she offer any information that made you think her accusations were true? If so, what?

    register voter mentioned details. What details?

    By Blogger Jeff Gillenwater, at 12:25 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • I feel the taxpayers and residence owes Ms. Valla Ann Bolovschak a sincere thank you. For having the courage to stand up and fight for us. I agree let's investigate! Let's force this Adminstration to put the truth and the WHOLE TRUTH ON THE TABLE. Thank You Ms.Bolovschak,for Representing my family.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 12:33 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • It is time to RALLY around Ms. Bolvschak. For the Injustice this Adminstration has Attack her for Questioning there spending habits. This Adminstration has turned this into A New Albany Witch hunt! Let's demand an Investigation. I plan to contact my councilman Steve Price. Great job Ms.Bolvschak You got my support.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 12:45 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • When i read her comments in the tribune. And Ms. Valla Ann Bolovschak said I will take full "responsibility of my actions." Says alot about her Character! Not once has this Adminstration been as honest as this Young Women has been. I am outraged!! Keep holding there feet to the fire!!!!!!! YOU HAVE MY SUPPORT.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 1:00 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • H-E-L-L-O-..What she says (If you attend Council Meetings) is the taxpayers of New Albany needs to know the truth. What our tax dollars are being used for. Where and how our tax dollars are being spent. One week read layoffs next week we hear. Need to borrow $500,000 Sewers. Keep City Going . Next week is needing to Borrow A few Million dollars for Scribner Place. That the Burden is to much on New Albany Taxpayers. "JUST TELL US THE DAMN TRUTH." This is why I Am Outraged over this Attack on Mrs. Bolovschak. She does have my total support. And I agree with her asking for an Investigation

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 1:21 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • I feel what motivates Ms. Bolovschak. Is the lack of the Adminstration not making information available to the taxpayers. She is asking the same Questions, we all discuss with my families and neighbors. I admire her guts and determination. To question Ms.Bolovschak Motive? Makes me so furious! You have my attention. And my support.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 1:43 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • This Adminstration needs to stop BASHING Ms.Valla Ann Bolovschak. Today I am ashamed of our town Paper to even print this Article. Anyone standing up for me in this town is ok in my book. Thank you Valla Ann. I plan to contact my elected official over this outrage.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 1:53 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • Bluegill, I must respond to your comment posted.....given the respect that i dont know you but it appears to me you have an education,but not one from Oxford,Nor do i believe that you have even considered contacting Ms.Vallann personaly, but would ask you to bring yourself to have a one on one chat with this wonderful understanding well educated professional woman.......i met her the end of last year, i was at cross roads with needing some important information, not sure how to go about getting what was needed.Mind you i didnt go to Oxford, first impressions can be decieving,Intimidated I was just that but only because she carried herself in a manor that made me feel proud knowing what i was hearing out of her mouth i had seen proof with my own eyes but wouldnt dare say or let on i knew , only of fear what could happen to me or my family...Mind you i have lived here all my life (36yrs) and dream of my children growing up in a city growing with opportunities....the sad thruth is there hasnt been any growth in down town for what now 10 plus years, my point being look at everything before you judge, maybe you havent got to talk to all the right people who will tell you actually whats going on, not what you want to hear....Believe me Ms.Vallann doesnt sugar coat anything.I lost my grandfather last yr (april)big enfluence in my life, his famous saying to me growing up was "Tell the truth and let it hurt, But to lie only will make it worse" Ms.Vallann is just that! Some people live by an unspoken code, loyality and honest a must...never to question yourself with those two things.... Shelly & Phil Bowen

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 1:56 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • Its an Outrage how a person can be attacked by simply asking the right questions to those who need to have the answers NOW.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 2:08 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • I Appreciate you standing up for me. I am Handicap and can not attend meetings. I watch the council Meetings on WNAS. I feel I know you from listening to you speak. Glad someone is helping us senior citizens. I Support Your Request for an Investigation.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 2:17 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • I am totally fed up. And upset with this Adminstration. And to top it off after reading Sat. Tribune. And the personal attacks on Ms. Valla Ann Bolovschak. I am beside myself without rage. What is motivating this Adminstration. To ask for this Investigation. There must be alot of smoke or this Witch hunt would not be going on. I Support you Ms. Bolovschak.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 2:25 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • Thanks Ms.Bolovschak for all the effort and work you have put trying to get the answers that are so needed, You are the talk on our block!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 2:38 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • It is time to either shut up or put up. Everyone in this town has a right to ask questions. Alot of us can not attend Council Meetings. I do appreciate Ms. Valla Ann Bolovschak asking the questions all of us want answers too. I want to know the truth in my property tax bill? Scribner Place is a joke. And anyone who attacks this Young Lady needs to be ashamed.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 2:40 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • Ive been to only a few of the Con. meetings , im disabled and getting out isnt as easy as i wish, but i must say the few meetings i have been to myself, Ms.Bolovschak spoke.She has my full attention and brought alot of things to light that you just cant hear about on the local news or paper, i give thanks for bringin me up to date with our local government and the lack of work being done.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 2:45 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • I FEEL MOST TAXPAYERS ARE FED UP WITH THIS CRAP! AND I WANT TO KNOW HOW MY TAX MONEY IS BEING SPEND. I FEEL THE NEW ALBANY TRIBUNE SHOULD PRINT A RETRACTION. THIS ADMINSTRATION HAS NO BUSINESS ATTACKING THIS BUSINESS WOMEN. FOR ASKING QUESTIONS. THIS ADMINISTRATION WOULD NOT KNOW SLANDER IF IT HIT THEM IN THE FACE. I SUPPORT YOUR EFFORTS MS. BOLOVSCHAK. YOU GOT US ALL BEHIND YOU.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 2:57 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • I can understand the frustration of feeling like you don't have all the information, but it's a pretty big jump from saying "we need information" to "you're a criminal".

    I fully support the public's right to know and speak, but that's not what this particular situation is about. Valla Ann didn't just say the public has a right to know or just ask questions this time. She made public allegations that people in the administration are involved in illegal activity.

    In order to say that you fully support Valla Ann in this case, you must also be willing to say that you think Garner and Garry are criminals. Are you willing to take that stance? If so, based on what evidence? Most of the comments have just been about wanting to know how tax dollars are spent.

    As far as the possible suit against Valla Ann is concerned, it's pretty simple from my point of view. If the allegations she made are true and she can prove it, then she's innocent of slander. If the allegations she made aren't true and she can't prove them, then she's guilty of slander and should be held accountable just like everyone else.

    I'd still like to ask why Schmidt and Price were so quick to jump on board. No questions at all? It doesn't make a lot of sense to me, unless they had some previous knowledge of the allegations or something.

    By Blogger Jeff Gillenwater, at 8:59 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • If Ms Valla Ann Bolovschak wants to run for mayor that is her business. But I say to you all why would she. This City is in a diaster. And everytime it seems like a person stands up to any adminstration they scream political motivated. This City Adminstration needs to look at themself. Based on being at this Council Meeting. I felt what Ms. Bolovschak was asking was solid questions. And that she informed the Council they had the authority to call for an investigation? I understood what she was saying. They also have a right to have an independent audit. I feel there is no merit for slander. I resent this attack on Ms. Bolovaschak. And support her effords for an Investigation.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 10:23 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • So what all this boils down to is this. You stand up to thi Administration. Like Ms. Valla Ann Bolovschak did. She reminds them that they work for her and all the people and taxpayers of New Albany. She states residents are not being informed? She ask for accountiability. And she ask all the other hard questions. What,why,how can you do this to the Residents and Taxpayers of New Albany? And this is the Adminstrations answer? A possiable suit against Ms. Bolovschak. I support her and demand an Investigation. I also agree if there is smoke there is fire!!!!!!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 10:38 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • Citizen, Tim Deatrick made a true statement and a challenge to the members
    of the City Council.. At the last council meeting, he said, "YOU COUNCIL MEMBERS SERVE AS A CHECK ON THE EXECUTIVE BRANCH OF THIS CITY". OK-- Council members, step up to the plate. Look at those
    reports being questioned, have you even asked for a copy?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 10:50 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 10:55 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 10:59 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • I feel this Adminstration has made a drastic mistake attacking Ms. Valla Ann Bolovschak. And as a resident and taxpayer I am also totally OUTRAGED! This problem is not a democrat or republician problem. It is Our Problem. When people do not have all the facts. How can anyone make the right decision. Or support any decision. She see's that each and everyone of us wants to be involve in this process of decision making. It is every business and homeowners money being spend. So we go and pay are property Taxes twice a year. Then we keep our mouth's shut. So this and any other Adminstration can spend,spend,spend and waste taxpayers money? What she has done for us Taxpayers is nothing but- "Pure Courage." To stand up and ask this Adminstration to inform us.And demand answers. She truly is "A Voice" for each and everyone of us...I am personally greatful for what she is doing for me. "A Democrat- A Homeowner and Taxpayer."

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 11:20 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • Some people don't work banker's hours. We support Valla Ann regardless what you say or think.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 11:52 AM, May 30, 2005  

  • To new albanian: No-- Mrs. Deatrick did not write the comment to compliment Tim Deatrick. In fact, I don't even know if Tim Deatrick is married.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 12:19 PM, May 30, 2005  

  • To new albanian: Your attempt to change
    the public attention to your jokes is very interesting. You see--- the people of New Albany don't think that these current concerns are a LAUGHING MATTER!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 12:24 PM, May 30, 2005  

  • This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 12:37 PM, May 30, 2005  

  • No, I meant his mom, not his wife, whether he has a wife, or whether or not she'd be anonymous if she were his wife ... or not.

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 1:01 PM, May 30, 2005  

  • There's one more question that's been puzzling me. Perhaps all you late night supporters and longtime Valla Ann friends can answer it.

    If the city is withholding information, and all of Valla Ann's accusations are aimed purely at making it accessible, where did she get HER information?

    By Blogger Jeff Gillenwater, at 3:21 PM, May 30, 2005  

  • This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 3:26 PM, May 30, 2005  

  • I did not place this statement on this blog. And I resent who ever changed my words and done this. I Do Support Ms.Valla Ann Bolovschak. And will notify Laura Oakes by email my outrage. This is typical New Albany B/S.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 6:41 PM, May 30, 2005  

  • i-supporther, is that really you? Gee, how can we tell?

    Verily, it's a sad day for free speech when anonymous posters can't trust each other!

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 6:52 PM, May 30, 2005  

  • This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 7:25 PM, May 30, 2005  

  • This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 7:58 PM, May 30, 2005  

  • This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 8:18 PM, May 30, 2005  

  • On this blog and others, several relative newcomers to the city and its political workings are extolling the integrity and capability of our current city controller, Mrs. Garry. Garry has served as controller on and off for a number of years, including under Doug England’s tenure. Hers is an appointed position. I do not know her personally, so I cannot and will not comment upon her personal reputation or conduct.

    However, let me ask you this: If Garry were your employee, how would you feel about her competency? If one of your company’s departments had made over a $2 million loan to another department, and it hadn’t been repaid according to terms, would you think your bookkeeper was doing a good job?

    If you had your finances independently audited, and the auditors found such poor record-keeping that they couldn't determine whether your company’s financial statements were accurate or not, would you be pleased with the person whose job it is to keep such records?

    What if assets were listed on your books but they could not be physically located?

    Would you want (or trust) this bookkeeper to prepare a budget for you after such issues came to light?

    By Blogger Ann, at 11:41 AM, May 31, 2005  

  • The question would be whether Mrs. Garry is trying to clean up a mess that existed prior to her appointment, or ka ka has occurred on her watch.

    I would like to have it all chronologically plotted, to see when these things first were known.

    When was the loan oversight discovered, and who discovered it?

    I seem to recall the state auditor noting sloppy bookkeeping as an institutional problem over time, not a sudden development.

    Certainly the profusion of controllers (4?) in a relatively short span of time, during both Republican and Democratic administrations, wasn't good in the sense of organization.

    Specifics?

    Or are specifics the exclusive domain of the sainted Valla Ann's private pre-mayoral investigation into the manner?

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 11:59 AM, May 31, 2005  

  • And several relative newcomers to the city are calling the lady a criminal. Garry wasn't the controller in 2002. Garry wasn't the controller in 2003.

    Good questions, Ann, but none that point to criminal conduct on Mrs. Garry's part. What do you know? Why won't you share it with us if you do? I've read the audit - have you? The Garner administration hasn't attacked anyone, but when attacked they have pointed out that these problems were inherited from the previous administration.

    Are you simply unhappy that Regina Overton wasn't reelected and simply continuing the campaign of 2003?

    And what does being a newcomer have to do with anything? You seem to think your friend is entitled to her opinion despite her only recent familiarity with city government. By the way, does your friend even live in this city? I heard she bought a home in Jeffersonville.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 12:07 PM, May 31, 2005  

  • I agree, Roger, that sloppy bookkeeping seems to have been the bane of New Albany for many, many years. But Mrs. Garry has been the controller for many, many years, too. So it seems to follow that she does bear a share of the responsibility for the financial mess we seem to be in. I doubt that she created it all, but I do not accept the excuse that it's all someone else's fault, either.

    Chronological plotting would be a good start to untangling the mess, but since it is a mess, I doubt it would be possible to graph things out with any degree of accuracy.

    Anonymous, I find your posting odd, bitter and antagonistic. I simply asked what your assessment of Mrs. Garry would be if she were your employee--which, incidentally, she is, if you are a city resident. Thoughful and respectful discourse would be appreciated.

    By Blogger Ann, at 12:37 PM, May 31, 2005  

  • That's a good point.

    Institutional slack in this instance would encompass both political parties.

    No one doubts that a good top to bottom revamp of practices would be a good idea.

    But would anyone posting here agree that money should be spent for it?

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 12:54 PM, May 31, 2005  

  • Annie, I find your post passive-agressive and disingenuous. First you slam "relative newcomers" as if they aren't entitled to speak or are too gullible to "understand" the reality as you know it.

    Your assumption is that a new administration has brought no increase in competency.

    Thoughful and respectful discourse WOULD be appreciated. Innuendo and slander are not. I would hope to see some.

    No one disputes that citizen oversight is something that this city has needed for a long time. Watchdogs are either disgraced by their own comments or drawn in to become insiders themselves.

    I have friends who are "relative newcomers" who will not go down either path because their goals aren't the protection of any party or person, but the good of the city. To say that anonymous's comment is "odd, bitter and antagonistic" does not contribute to "thoughtful and respectful discourse" is in itself inherently disrespectful, even if clothed in passive-aggressive language. Thoughtful discourse requires rational arguments, which yours was not. Trying to paint Kay Garry as the culprit for the incompetencies of others doesn't show respect.

    How passive-aggressive? QUOTE:

    "I do not know her personally, so I cannot and will not comment upon her personal reputation or conduct.

    However, let me ask you this: If Garry were your employee, how would you feel about her competency?"

    However? That's like saying I think you are a kind and thoughtful person, however...and then proceeding to vilify you and tie you to criminal conduct.

    You have jumped to defend a woman who has accused Mrs. Garry of criminal conduct. You then proceed to tie her to the incompetence of previous controllers.

    Who do you think found these problems, exposed them, and proposed a solution?

    You can't have it both ways. You can't slop about in the mud and then complain when your dress gets dirty, Annie.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 1:14 PM, May 31, 2005  

  • New Albanian, it is definitely a problem that encompasses both parties. When political appointments are made after a mayoral election, I've never seen a canvass for the most qualified person, or even a solicitation for resumes. The appointees always seem to be folks who worked to get the Mayor elected--or their sons, daughters, spouses, cousins, etc. I wonder what the process is to do away with allowing crucial positions like building commissioner and city controller to be political appointments?

    It's probably not a wise use of funds to try to identify the culprits--because what good would it do, anyway? We know that it has been an ongoing problem, and the task at hand now is to get ourselves out of the mess, do away with the mess-makers, and try to move the city forward.

    To Not Fooled: I won't be goaded into arguing with you. I have limited time to read and post, so I only address those who seem to have a genuine interest in the issues and wish to have a thoughtful exchange, even though they may have a different viewpoint than mine.

    By Blogger Ann, at 1:45 PM, May 31, 2005  

  • Like I mention in my other comments. There is no merit for slanter. If you were at the last Council Meeting anyone with any sense knows Ms. Bolovschak did not slander Mrs. Garry or this Adminstration. I ask myself what does this Adminstration have to hide. And I totally agree with many others on this blog. Where there's smoke there is fire! If they have nothing to hide why are they attacking this educated business women. And a outstanding citizen of New Albany. Ms.Bolovchak, you or I have a right to ask questions. And from were I'm sitting very valid questions. Thank goodness for this is free speech. I still ask Mr. Baylor what is your agenda? Like I have read your always right? In 2004 You were Anti Garner. It seems with all your attack on Ms. Valla Ann Bolovchak you seem to be very jealous of this brillant Business women. From what i hear she could teach you a few things. MANNERS........

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 6:22 PM, May 31, 2005  

  • the new albanian: You need to consider anger management classes! Thank goodness no one has even offered to pay you by your printed words. Talk about smoke and mirrors. It will be nice on Wed. when Laura comes back she deletes all your comments. She has continued to ask you to stop attacking these bloggers. Your the joke of New Albany. And so is N/A Blog.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 6:35 PM, May 31, 2005  

  • Good job concerned taxpayer.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 8:50 PM, May 31, 2005  

  • New Alb Annie: I wasn't thinking so much of using funds to identify culprits as paying to have a modern, functional computer system and software.

    Legalbeagle: I am neither Democratic nor Republican. I am a progressive, which means I am for progress, and opposed to regress.

    If this means siding occasionally with Mayor Garner, so be it. If it means agreeing with Valla Ann Bolovschak -- so be it. If it means opposing the Luddites ... you get the idea.

    That's the complete agenda.

    (I'm Roger A. Baylor, and Miss Manners approved this message).

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 10:00 PM, May 31, 2005  

  • Roger: I thought you meant spending $$$ for investigation--got it now.

    I wonder if accounting software and hardware has ever been budgeted for or purchased, and if so, when, what was purchased, from whom, and can it be upgraded?

    I don't know if you recall this, but when England was mayor, he managed to get a $50,000 grant to build a city website. I was so excited, because $50k can build a pretty nice site, especially several years ago. But he didn't put it out for bid and gave it to a friend/political buddy of his to create.

    That's apparently how we got a .com address for the city instead of a .gov, and the resulting site was obviously not $50k worth of work. It made me ask, what did they do with all that money?

    So I wonder if dollars that are allocated for major purchases are being shopped around as they should be. I know there have been questions raised by some of the public regarding city insurance costs, because past mayors (not sure about Garner) have insisted on dealing with Ed Culpepper instead of getting competitive bids like Jeffersonville did. Culpepper has a history of being a large campaign contributor.

    By Blogger Ann, at 7:11 AM, June 01, 2005  

  • I always wondered where the .com originated.

    Guess with his business experience, the boy just couldn't help it.

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 9:53 AM, June 01, 2005  

  • Annie,

    I'd be surprised if there weren't some state mandated regulations concerning the bidding of goods and services. I certainly don't know for sure but, when I worked at IUS, there were very strict rules that required that any purchases over a certain dollar amount to be bid out. If you didn't go with the lowest bid, you had to document your reasoning in case of an audit.

    If there aren't rules passed down from the state, though, it might be a good topic around which to develop some policy.

    To make that and other accounting policies feasible with such a small number of people, though, I agree with Roger that a little technology might go a long way. It's my understanding that the Garner administration, and Marcy Wisman in particular, are the first to push for any serious technology upgrades but I have no idea if they've been successful or to what degree.

    I find it ridiculous that the city is just now considering the value of networked computing services, regardless of who's held office. I fear, though, that if the city was to pursue a modern solution, there'd be a backlash from those who don't see the value.

    Any thoughts?

    By Blogger Jeff Gillenwater, at 10:11 AM, June 01, 2005  

  • I am sure there would be a backlash. The city has so many needs, and prioritizing them in a way that would be acceptable to everyone seems nigh impossible.

    But it is almost impossible to do business today in any sort of efficient fashion if your organization isn't networked.

    I guess my highest priority would be the planning before the purchasing. I get the feeling that only a few people in our elected positions have private-sector business experience, and they don't seem to operate with an eye toward the future, or with any type of business plan.

    I can't blame it all on the good-ole-boy network, although that plays a part in keeping the city stagnant. I think a big part of the problem is lack of training, education and experience, and knowing how to get the most bang for the tax bucks we provide to city administration to spend.

    By Blogger Ann, at 11:43 AM, June 01, 2005  

  • Although I was tempted to delete more, I think New Alb Annie handled herself, and everyone else, just fine.
    Letting things run their course can often times be more informative and revealing than any amount of debate or rhetoric could ever accomplish.
    You guys were very busy over the Holiday weekend.
    Happy Summer Everyone!

    By Blogger East Ender, at 1:59 AM, June 02, 2005  

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