Speak Out Loud NA

Tuesday, June 13, 2006

What's the big deal with anonymity?

Much ado has been made in the New Albany area blogosphere, in no small part by the prostituted progressives, about the anonymity or pseudonymity of contributors and posters. Even Speak Out Loud NA recently waded into these choppy waters, changing course only to reverse yet again.

Western civilization has a long history of anonymous and pseudonymous commentators and authors dating from at least the Greco-Roman era. These people were, may I say without trying to offend anyone, writing much more eloquently and intelligently than any of us (myself included) are in these local blogs. Much of our outstanding literature (Shakespeare?), important political discourse (Camillus?), and even perhaps New Testament writings (Pauline attributions?) were published anonymously or pseudonymously.

Many of the anonymous and pseudonymous political contributors, in fact, helped to shape the formation and direction of our nation, perhaps best exemplified by Benjamin Franklin and his many (alleged) pseudonyms.

Likewise, modern investigative journalism has come to rely upon the anonymous source (Watergate?), and many states and the federal government have enacted whistleblower statutes, which protect the identities of those who come forward.

“So What’s the Big Deal?”

Well, there is no big deal with unknown writers.

Many of the pro-progressives, and others of their ilk who seem to think they are somehow more enlightened than others, rant and rave about anonymous/pseudonymous posts. They claim that such submittals somehow carry less intellectual worth or veracity, although they cannot articulate the reasons why. Such comments from those who sport their own blogs are especially humorous, given the overall tone of contemptuousness in their publications. Dare not post anything in dissent of the ‘bookman’ – he will try his feeble best to eviscerate both you and your opinion.

The real and only reason for the desire to know and control ‘who writes what’ is the patently obvious, yet unstated desire to quash any debate by those who dare disagree with their opinions, or chosen leaders. How would knowing a person’s identity perhaps quash the debate? There are two main reasons. The first is quite obvious in a small town and community such as ours (and like those where I grew up in my home state). If a person must disclose who they are, they will not participate in the debate in the first place, for fear of losing their job, their relatives losing jobs, not getting a job/contract, scorn from their neighbors, hassled by law enforcement, etc, etc. This is especially true if what such people wish to say cuts against the current leadership, and the local press is in the pocket of said leadership. The second reason is the belief that, if a person’s identity is known, that fact can somehow be used to undermine their position – skeletons in the closet if you will. [Note: Keep in mind, only P-P’s are capable of throwing the first stone….]

A minor, humorous third reason focuses on “frustrated censorship.” Most ‘enlightened’ folks, and P-P’s, are in reality closet socialists. They decry the open press (Rush? SOLNA?) and are frustrated by the electoral process. We “little people” do not know how to write, to whom we should listen, nor for whom to vote – we are much too stupid to be entrusted with such things, “troglodytes” if you will. But please do not hold this fact against them. Many do not even know (yet) that they are closet socialists. It is analogous to the person not yet ready to enter rehab, because many have not reached the point where they can admit to themselves that a problem does indeed exist. That damned Berlin Wall never fell!

”Just the Facts, Ma’am”

The only real issue is the facts of a given situation. As long as the debate centers on the facts, it matters not the identity of the debaters. Facts can be verified, no matter from where or by whom they were disclosed.

Facts about investigations, facts about sewer overflows, facts about city finances, facts about multiple paid positions, etc.

Those who protest against the anonymity and pseudonymity of this blog simply do not want the facts to surface, especially those which focus attention, perhaps negatively, on their self-anointed leaders. By focusing instead only on the issue that those in the debate are unknown, they are simply trying to detract attention from the facts of the argument.

These protestors attempt in vain to practice the old legal adage -- don’t cloud the issue with facts.

”The Ultimate Anonymity”

I would encourage all to continue to post anonymously or pseudonymously, and stick to the facts of the situation. It is a large part of our democratic heritage and political debate. Those who protest against it will continue to do so – just laugh and let it ride, you certainly cannot stop it.

And this fall, I would encourage all of appropriate age to practice perhaps the longest, constitutionally protected right of anonymity we have: VOTE to throw the current mayor out of office!

Just don’t ask me who I am!

blogtastic

69 Comments:

  • WELL SAID. KEEP IT UP

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 4:52 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • Well said but flawed.

    The problem with this argument is that anonymity traditionally refers to one voice representing one person. Unlike the days of Ben Franklin, the readers of this blog have no assurance that one person or twenty persons are represented in the comments section. Example - perhaps I am blogtasic and responding to my own post, have a sick sense of humor and am playing with your heads. Or perhaps I am concern citizen or Roger or one of the many anonymous entries. The truth is I have written pro and con about this blog and have never meant a word of it - or did I? You'll never know the truth because I'm not tangible or credible.

    Have fun with your blog, just don't get delusions of grandeur. You don't represent the little people, only a little amount of people.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 5:09 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • anonymous little people thank you!
    A BIG AMEN ON YOUR POST...........................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................3 CHEERS FOR THE TRUTH!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 5:12 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • blogtastic for mayor!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 5:13 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • sorry, i just wrote that blogtastic should be mayor just to illustrate that anyone can be anonymous. I really don't want blogtastic for mayor.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 5:16 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • Well said. Thank you.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 5:19 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • Well said to Blogtastic, that is.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 5:19 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • i am blogtastic!
    I am Spartacus!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 5:23 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • blogtastic -
    Thanks for submitting those words of wit and wisdom.
    The folks that utilize this blog for its intended purpose, as a means of sharing information, are well within their rights as well as accepted practice, that all citizen's voices deserve to be heard.
    To those who spend so much time and effort in trying to silence these voices, we want to say we're sorry.
    We're sorry if you don't like it, but that's too bad.
    We're sorry you can't debate the FACTS, and have to resort to name calling, that's too bad.
    We're sorry if the facts interfere with your plans, but that's too bad.
    We're sorry the City can't afford to build $17 million swimming pools and fix the Sewers at the same time, but that's too bad.
    But, what's really too bad is that the greedy politicians just couldn't keep their hands off our money.
    Do you really think that citizens will now willingly allow that same political body to use our property taxes to back up those bonds???
    That's too bad.

    By Blogger East Ender, at 7:41 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • Blogtastic,

    Don't be discouraged by Roger's comments. I don't know who you are but I think you are wonderful. Thank you for speaking up for us anonymous little people.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 8:13 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • Sorry Roger, but the dissertations must be submitted for approval before posting.
    Your response, as you know, is far too long-winded and mostly a repeat of what we've read so many times before.
    Really, it's getting old, and it's really not a very good argument if your intent is to convince folks that revealing their identity will not invite reprisals.
    Still, just to be nice, I'll offer to put the shortened version of it back up (without copied article). If you want folks to read the WHOLE THING (snore), put it on NAC.
    Capisch?

    By Blogger East Ender, at 8:35 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • Maybe if your blog wasn't full of rumor, innuendo, and unusually bad information (not to mention poor sentence structure, spelling and diction.) it would not be quite an issue. I may not always agree with NAC but at least I know who they are.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 8:46 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • Right on nuclear Physicist. You said it.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 8:47 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • Yeah you're right Nuclear and annon. 8:47

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 8:49 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • Annon. 8:47 and 8:49 r real posers.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 8:50 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • Are you gonna let that annon 8:50 comment stand.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 8:51 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • Yeah.
    See how nice you pp's are about folks who have 'other' opinions, or an opinion at all?
    When all else fails, attack their grammer skills!
    We're sorry you don't like the actions of our 'leaders' being put out here for everyone to read. That's too bad.
    Despite whatever spin you try to put on it, there's only one way to spell FRAUD.

    By Blogger East Ender, at 8:59 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • Boy, EE, ya really got me there. Kinda like a Venus fly trap, without the charm.

    Nah, you can keep it. I'll just post on NAC instead.

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 9:02 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • Please be careful, blogastic. We need you. You have such a good way of saing what were think ing and would say if we could. You need to keep your creddibilaty high and you can’t make any mistakes or those vicious PP’s will be all over you.
    We can see that you read books, too, but you aren’t like those arrogant know it alls on that other blog. You know what you mean to say and noone can make you say it.
    The anonymous Ben Franklin made this country safe for us to speak out without being caught saying it, like you said. So what if whistle blower laws don’t really let you rat someone out without identifying yourself. We know what you mean. Keep it up, blogtastic.
    Your right! Our fear is real. We are afraid to stand behind our words because our jobs and family. The bookman is feeble. He’s not afraid for people to know what he thinks, but we are. Watch his store go out of buisiness when people find out he’s for the mayor’s swimming pool.We won’t be quiet, not with you to defend us.
    Proudly anonymous. SOLNA is the one place we can say anything and nobody can tell us to shut up. YOU SHUT UP ROGER.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 9:20 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • i'm blogtastic

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 9:30 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • no I'm blogtastic

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 9:31 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • you anonymous liar I'm blogtastic

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 9:31 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • i'm blogtastics evil twin

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 9:32 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • I'm ben franklin

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 9:33 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • i'm elvis

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 9:33 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • What Grammer skills? Half you guys can't find the caps lock key.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 9:39 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • i dont know who this blogtastic person is. he could be a serial killer or a convict or dan coffee. but he sounds so smart. i'm going to name my next kid after him.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 10:00 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • Well...well.... Isn't roger up to his own shit again. The best part about writing anonymous id idiots like roger who has no sense of direction. He thinks he is important because him and randy are in bed with the Mayor. To be such a so called educated person. He is the biggest ass-hole in New Albany. (Sirry laura). He thinks that he can sit and judge people and play god! James Garner is the worst mayor next to chas hunter! Hwe has no clue to what it is like to have a real job. This guy could not know what it is like to struggle and live payday to payday. The citizens of New Albany just want a fair shake. If these ignorant so called progressives looked at a green bar and saw what we have seen and actually knew what they were reading. They would be as mad as hell. Because alot of us do not chose to give our names were shit! Well Mr. Baylor I know several of your relatives in Georgetown and several of your neighbors. If you spent as much time on slandering people like yvonne, laura and attack others. You might be alittle smart to start keeping your mouth shut. Some of you folks do not realize how many people read these blogs. When you get up at a council meeting and act like your the owner of NA. You never know in this city who might just knock you on your ass! This is not a threat but you have no idea the people you have went over the line on.....

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 10:14 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • Will the real blogtastic please stand up!

    Oh, you are standing!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 10:29 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • Yawwnn.

    Blogtastic, any time you’d like a hearty discussion – a good old fashioned tete-a-tete – then c’mon down. Progressive pints and pizza are on me. I’m sure you’ll have many more reasons, some of them perhaps even plausible, why such engagement is utterly impossible, but honor dictates that I’m the first to ask.

    Maybe Laura's random censorship generator won't pluck this one.

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 11:03 PM, June 13, 2006  

  • Of course!
    We should have expected that one.
    "Come on down and let's have a chat."
    Names and addresses sure make this part a lot easier, huh? Takes out the pesky detective work.
    We understand why that name thing is so important.
    Tell us Roger, how persuasive can you be? What are your tactics?
    What do you tell folks who have been lied to and taken advantage of to the tune of multi-millions of dollars?
    How do you convince them that these same people should now be trusted to pledge our property taxes for bond assurance?
    Do you really expect that folks are going to believe that NOW, the greedy 'insiders' are really concerned with doing what's best for the City?
    What's the profit on those bonds going to be?
    That's right... about $200,000.
    How about they offer to put that money back into the sewer fund?
    Maybe then we might believe they are really concerned with what's best for the City.

    By Blogger East Ender, at 2:31 AM, June 14, 2006  

  • Glad to see you back Blogtastic. Sounds like you were doing some good work while you away from town. Kudo's.

    I see the double standards are still at work over here. From your posting:

    "Dare not post anything in dissent of the ‘bookman’ – he will try his feeble best to eviscerate both you and your opinion."

    Would this be the same as East Ender did to me last week? Attacked me for being against anonymous postings, which I never have been and she knew better. Accused me of hiding behind a cloak, while she knew my real name all along. etc, etc.

    As I have said many times before, there is plenty of blame to go around. It is not near as one sided as you try to make it.

    Mark Cassidy

    By Blogger Iamhoosier, at 9:45 AM, June 14, 2006  

  • IAMHOOSIER: I thought EastEnder apologized for that and forgot she did have your name.

    Then, you put it out there for all to see.

    There goes the distraction from the issues again, and this is how we will call it. Sorry.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 10:07 AM, June 14, 2006  

  • I have just finished going back through the past postings on this site, and I have never seen a group of individuals so focused on one issue at the expense of every other problem in the city.

    It is as if the sewers are the only thing ailing N.A. Once those are fixed...well it will be Shangri-La. It's probably time for you people to realize that you can't focus like a laser on only one problem while the rest of the problems multiply. Yes, fixing the sewers is a must, but what good will that do unless we make "progress" in other areas as well.

    Maybe it's time for the SOLNA crew to sit a few plays out and finally see the forrest for the trees.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 10:50 AM, June 14, 2006  

  • Anon 10:07,
    There was NO apology. Said she "forgot". Tried to imply that we shared only one email. I have been consistent on allowing anonymous posts. It is not like I don't post quite often and that she could have "forgot" that too.

    By the way, my comments are totally within the context of the main post for this thread. Also by the way, I had asked EE two questions and she launched into her untruthful attacks. Never did answer the questions or even attempt too. It is called distraction from the issue at hand. Sorry.

    By Blogger Iamhoosier, at 11:09 AM, June 14, 2006  

  • Having the sewers fixed may not make New Albany Shangri-La but at least we won't be dumping raw sewage in the Ohio River or Falling Run Creek.

    How can you accuse people of focusing on one issue like a laser? What about your obsession with Scribner Place?

    In a perfect world we would have our sewers fixed AND have a YMCA without they taxpayers having to shell out a dime. Other cities have this, why not New Albany?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 11:42 AM, June 14, 2006  

  • Other communities have done this, but that isn't our situation. If we want to move forward, we must make a commitment.

    Fixing the sewers should be a priority, that is not in dispute. But we can't ignore other projects and possibilities while we work on them. No one will have sewage in their yard because of Scribner Place. No harmful pollutants will be dumped into our water supply because of downtown investment.

    I just can't wrap my mind around how anyone can look at the small amount of money we would be putting into this project compared to the huge possible gains and not be all up on the bandwagon.

    You guys obviously represent the powerful New Albany lobbying group "Citizens Against Virtually Everything" (CAVE)

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 11:51 AM, June 14, 2006  

  • It's simple, EE.

    I appreciate Blogtastic's wit and rhetorical style even though we disagree on matters, and it's pleasing to find signs of intelligent life on any and alkl sides of the aisle.

    But, as you proved last evening by censoring my response, I'll not be able to have a conversation with him/her in this space, because you won't allow it.

    We can't do it at NAC because he/she disagrees with the blog policy on posting.

    Okay. We might take it to a private e-mail discussion, we might be able to exchange ideas and ripostes across the table at the pub, or we may never do either, but one thing I know is that for whatever twisted reason, you won't allow it here.

    In the end, it's your conscience, Laura. I'm perfectly content that NAC's gained about 15% hits and page views in the past week. The site meter's there for all to see.

    It might mean something. It might mean nothing. The truth's somewhere in between. The point to me is that the site meter's public record, our identities are public record, and we'll stand by our words with our names, come what may.

    That's the way I was taught by my parents, and although my father may have been a high school dropout, he was no dummy. He didn't accept being patronnized, and neither should anyone here.

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 12:23 PM, June 14, 2006  

  • Ugh! White man speakem with forked tounge, Kemosabe!

    "Coffey said he would be satisfied with the project’s financing if he had assurance that $137,500 a year was a maximum."

    Needem plenty help, not play with full deck of cards! Chicken leg short of full picnic basket!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 1:38 PM, June 14, 2006  

  • That's bullsh** Roger.
    You know exactly what to do to make sure your comments will go against "house rules" so you can turn, yet again, to this obsurd accusation of censorship.
    I offered to put the comment back up sans the Stars & Stripes speech.
    YOU answered no.
    On this blog EVERYONE's opinion is allowed, and EVERYONE is permitted to discuss, debate, or flat out argue so long as it doesn't violate the laws of common decency.
    Now, your next argument is going to be; what is the definition of "common decency"?
    Let me put it this way...
    That's at my discretion.
    Here's why; I continue to believe that most adults in our community are capable of discussing civic affairs without personally attacking one another's basic human dignity.
    Of course, there are those such as yourself who refuse to acknowledge those boundaries of dignity, that modicum of respect, which seperates good debate from pure bullying.

    By Blogger East Ender, at 2:07 PM, June 14, 2006  

  • Gee, EE, of course you were willing to put up my comments without the Stars and Stripes letter, since the Stars and Stripes letter was the major point of rebuttal!

    That's not BS, EE, that's fact -- and because you knew it, you censored it.

    By Blogger The New Albanian, at 2:13 PM, June 14, 2006  

  • So, brevity is a measure of decency?

    By Blogger Jeff Gillenwater, at 2:17 PM, June 14, 2006  

  • See, that's how you keep missing the mark.
    That man's letter isn't a fact, that's an opinion.
    The FACT is there is a lot of money missing.
    The FACT is there's been a lot of bad decisions made.
    The FACT is they can't produce valid financials.
    Your OPINION may be that none of that matters, but the FACT is that it does indeed matter.
    Garner's re-election campaign:
    "I AM NOT A CROOK"

    By Blogger East Ender, at 3:37 PM, June 14, 2006  

  • Blogtastic

    You said - I do not understand your traditional understanding of anonymity.



    I think you understand it all very well and in fact show your true motivation within your statements. Your prose is to well written to believe in the diatribe printed daily here. You know that there are rarely facts presented here, just emotions sprinkled with some numbers.

    When Franklin and others in his time used anonymity it was for a few purposes; to sell a publication and/or to sway public opinion toward a rebellion. For either purpose, it was to create a cloud in which facts were inconsequential. The motivation in these cases of anonymity was to attract attention. So it is here.

    I suggest that you are doing and describing in anonymity is what Swiftboat was to Kerry. I suggest that you are only a republican official or wannabe mayor simply trying to stir it up before the next election – playing on and with these people’s emotions and hoping to sway votes. That’s fine under normal conditions, but you are contributing to the stagnation of this community for political gain by trying to legitimize their cause. Shame on you.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 3:40 PM, June 14, 2006  

  • Comments too long will not be posted. Fair enough.

    "common decency" and you left up ..... well, you know which one I am talking about.

    Your definition of "too long" probably is reasonable. Your definition of "common decency" is sure different from mine. Or do you mean it depends on who posted the indecent comment?

    By Blogger Iamhoosier, at 3:53 PM, June 14, 2006  

  • Excuse the interruption, Blogtastic. I realize your thread is about anonymity but EE seems to be having difficulty staying on topic and I'd like to respond.

    EE, you've been claiming that Mayor Garner is a crook for well over a year now. The word "crook" in general parlance, is used to denote someone involved in illegal activity.

    Given your recent comments regarding facts and their importance in establishing credibility, what factual evidence do you have linking Mayor Garner (or any other politician for that matter) to criminal acts?

    By Blogger Jeff Gillenwater, at 4:23 PM, June 14, 2006  

  • blogtastic,
    I write anonymous because I work in the city county building. And believe me if you ever worked there you might understand why. Iam not willing to loose my job because of all that I see. And Alot of wrong doing going on. It is not what you do but who you know.

    The problems with New Albany are many. I have never actually read that any blogger on SOLNA say they were against the YMCA. And the progressives want to go off half cocked and say we want this and we want that. If you look at the figures. And actually have an open mind no one in there right mind would agree with commiting property taxes to back up the loan. It is like the citizen are co-signing for a person who is a loose cannon!

    After all the buzz in the building today, after reading the CJ. Councilman Mccallister ask the county atty. what happens if the boat goes belly-up? Well the answer was then the city will have to pay for Scribner Place and not the county. Then you go on to read they can take any and all the EDIT money.
    If you don't think the sewers is not a real issue. You all better think again. The EPA can nail NA. And take over the whole damn town.

    The city is broke regardless of what roger and others say. There is problems in all areas of local government. Fire Dept does not have enough fireman. The street Dept is getting ready to have job cuts. There is so much corruption in that building it is flat scary. But like everyone else I need my job!

    Why are you so insecure roger you have to have a counter on your blog? But I believe it is ego!

    My questions to Blogtastic is the following:
    What is the difference in this and the other blogs? Do you read all the blogs? Do you really think Scribner Place will be the save all of New Albany? Do you think certain blogs are being fair to the council members? Have you had the oppt. to read any finicial reports? Do you think the mayor is controling the council? Since 4 has family or relatives or themself on the city payroll? What are your thoughts on conflict of interest problems with elected or appointed officials? Do you believe a women can run this city?
    How can we undo the damage that is being done?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 5:48 PM, June 14, 2006  

  • To 11:51 Anon 6/14 - WHAT PART OF WE DON'T HAVE ANY MONIES LEFT AND NO FINANCIALS TO MAKE ANY KIND OF RATIONAL DECISION MAKING UPON?

    That's all we want to know, which part do you not understand; and how can anyone not understand our property taxes are on the line. If Riverboat funds are pulled out later on down the line by the new ownership, the County's part stops, and our property is then on the line.

    Messer ran on a "pay as you go" platform. Garner ran on "don't want to put all that EDIT in one basket; other projects may come along; needs a feasibility study. What happened to all of those issues alone?

    We for one, as homeowners, will contact who we need to and be sure and let them know this City has NO FINANCIALS; the ones the Council have now are 100,000's off; and it's our ***** on the lines.

    Trust us, says Garner and Redevelopment and DNA. Nah...already have and that track record does not look good. I'm from Missouri -- show me the facts. Can't do that, what does that say?

    Thank you for space and opinions.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 5:53 PM, June 14, 2006  

  • 5:48 Thank you for some real questions. I also hope blogtastic answers them all.

    Our family is proud to be one of the little people in New Albany too.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 9:27 PM, June 14, 2006  

  • Who has relatives on the city payroll besides kochert and coffey and blevins?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 9:28 PM, June 14, 2006  

  • To freedom of speech--the reason gahan does not want to consider it until the fall is because he knew they did not need the money now. Fifer wanted to get the money this spring, gee I wonder why. Gahan has said that he does not want them to have it until next year, when and IF they need it.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 9:38 PM, June 14, 2006  

  • Freedom of Speech

    re: conflicting information

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 9:56 PM, June 14, 2006  

  • 5:48 Thank you for some real questions. I also hope blogtastic answers them all.

    Our family is proud to be one of the little people in New Albany too.

    Whaaaatttt!!!!!

    how did blogtastic get to be an expert on city affairs? why are you people following someone you do not know?

    as mom used to say, if he said go jump in a lake would you jump?

    I've got a bridge to sell you real cheap.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 10:02 PM, June 14, 2006  

  • Looks like Freedom of Speech hit the nail on the head again.

    Mayor James Garner,
    You are raping and robbing the taxpayers of New Albany
    You might win the battle for Scribner Place but you will not win the war.

    You will finally hear all the voices and see the will of the people on election day.

    That's courage folks.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 7:12 AM, June 15, 2006  

  • THE GREAT THING ABOUT AMERICA IS FREEDOM OF SPEECH.

    GREAT ARTICLE

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 7:30 AM, June 15, 2006  

  • GLAD GARNER HAS TAKEN OUR RIGHTS AWAY YET? wHAT I WANT TO KNOW IS HOW MUCH MORE DAMAGE CAN THIS MAYOR DO?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 4:40 PM, June 15, 2006  

  • ooops meant "hasn't taken our rights away!" lord knows he'd like to shut alot of us up.
    I love the meat and patato message of FOS.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 4:43 PM, June 15, 2006  

  • anon at 3:40 PM wrote:

    ”Your prose is to (sic) well written to believe in the diatribe printed daily here. You know that there are rarely facts presented here, just emotions sprinkled with some numbers.”

    While admittedly there is a lot of emotion and opinion on this blog, as with any, there are more facts presented here than on any other local blog: for example, city financial statements, audit results, EPA letters, links to CSO reports, photographs, etc. You simply do not wish to read or acknowledge them, nor address the situations raised therein; and your presumptuous statement regarding my true beliefs is well off target.

    ”I suggest that you are only a republican official or wannabe mayor simply trying to stir it up before the next election – playing on and with these people’s emotions and hoping to sway votes.”

    My goodness, one should be so blessed to have your powers of clairvoyance! Please tell me the winning numbers for Powerball this evening; l’ll purchase the ticket, and split the pot 50-50 with you.

    I am not a [R]epublican official, nor have any desire to ever be one again. And I definitely have no aspirations on running for mayor, although there are indeed a few people I am encouraging to run. If you had read some of my previous posts, you would realize that I have no true party allegiance and have supported and continue to support both D and R candidates and elected officials. While I am a fiscal and social conservative, in the last primary (and again in this fall’s general elections) the signs in my yard, financial contributions and personal anonymous voting will no doubt once again reflect the political party diversity of the candidates I support. I will likewise support the best candidate for mayor next year, be it a D or R. From the somewhat heated manner deduced from your characterization of me, perhaps I can suggest that you are simply a one party lever puller?

    You are, however, spot on in identifying my attempt to sway votes. Since the mayor has no interest in addressing some of the major problems facing the city, I will do everything in my power to see him defeated every step of the way: party support-nomination, primary and/or general elections. Myself and others have called and written the mayor with our concerns and suggestions, and have met with stone silence. He cares not about this city, has not one articulated idea for seeing it progress, and knows not how to listen.

    ”That’s fine under normal conditions, but you are contributing to the stagnation of this community for political gain by trying to legitimize their cause.”

    My desire is to help get this community past the current stagnation in which it finds itself, due in large part to the complete vacuum in inspired and progressive leadership from the mayor’s administration, by focusing on the facts about situations which are occurring in our city.

    Since you desire to foray deeper into the local political situation, I posted a question back on March 23, 2006 on this blog, to which I have yet to receive an answer. This is especially noteworthy given the rabid, pro-progressive blogasms that occur on this blog (most anonymously, I may add) whenever anyone dare question the mayor. You would think from this defense that the mayor’s very likeness appears on the cover of some ˜Progressive Leadership” treatise! I posit the question once again at the end of this message; please feel free to answer it.

    [As an aside, your historical characterization of Franklin and other pseudonymous and anonymous writers in our early history are both conceptually and factually incorrect. It is too long to go into here, but if you wish to email me, I’ll point you to several great books and other sources on late colonial/early U.S. journalism, Franklin and some other founders and their writings.]

    Now once again, the question from my earlier post:

    ”What has the mayor done in the past two+ years, or plans to do in the next year, which is or was his idea or that of his administration, and against which he did not vote while on the Council, that has or will bring substantive, positive change to the City of New Albany?”

    ”It just has to be his idea, and it doesn’t even need to be completed yet. I’m not looking to debate the issue, I just want to know.”

    As always, feel free to answer anonymously! Just make sure your answers are factual!

    --
    Posted by blogtastic to Speak Out Loud NA at 6/14/2006 11:07:42 PM

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 6:06 PM, June 16, 2006  

  • OK, BT.

    The mayor is willing to support the modification of traffic patterns to eliminate the one-way traffic on Spring, Elm, and Market streets, making Elm once again a neighborhood street, and Spring once again a thriving street.

    Knock it down, why don't you. The mayor has the numbers, and has stated them publicly. He has declared his support. Fact.

    Do you support it, or are you stuck in the 60s?

    Posted by Anonymous to Speak Out Loud NA at 6/15/2006 01:56:09 AM

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 6:53 PM, June 16, 2006  

  • Flat to this argument. The Mayor DOES NOT HAVE THE NUMBERS. Well, he has several set of numbers; the latest provided off by hundreds of thousands of dollars.

    INDOT & and neighborhood have been pushing for Spring to return to the two way it was originally designed for to take trucks much quicker to the expressway. His idea?

    Knock it down. Blogtastic, please don't knock it down. If I only had my druthers, I'd tell you to "knock it up"!

    Let's see, how do I wish to sign this -- oh, I got it,

    Posted by A Blogtastic Fan to Speak Out Loud NA at 6/15/2006 03:24:41 AM

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 6:55 PM, June 16, 2006  

  • You have failed to meet the most basic requirement of the request:
    That it be an original idea of Garner's.
    Not someone else's idea that he has promised to throw his support behind (in exchange for what?).
    Changing traffic patterns from one-ways to two-ways on three major thoroughfares in the city is not a Garner original.
    The mission to turn Spring St. into a two-way street is that of a certain "Bookman" looking to increase traffic in his Spring St. location.
    Other than racheting up the number of potential customers for Randy, what broader "substantive, positive change[s]" could such an expensive undertaking produce for the city?

    Posted by East Ender to Speak Out Loud NA at 6/15/2006 03:41:09 AM

    By Blogger East Ender, at 6:56 PM, June 16, 2006  

  • If Blogtastic admits to seeking voter sway, doesn't that make the comments political?

    And hasn't EE noted on numerous occasions that this blog was not to be political?

    Hmm, sounds hypocritical to me.

    Posted by Anonymous to Speak Out Loud NA at 6/15/2006 07:22:00 AM

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 6:59 PM, June 16, 2006  

  • Looks like Freedom of Speech hit the nail on the head again.

    Mayor James Garner,
    You are raping and robbing the taxpayers of New Albany
    You might win the battle for Scribner Place but you will not win the war.

    You will finally hear all the voices and see the will of the people on election day.

    That's courage folks.

    Posted by CHARLES MARTIN FAMILY to Speak Out Loud NA at 6/15/2006 07:12:56 AM

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 7:01 PM, June 16, 2006  

  • Off topic.

    Seems to be a power shift occurring on this blog.

    Posted by Iamhoosier to Speak Out Loud NA at 6/15/2006 08:16:41 AM

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 7:03 PM, June 16, 2006  

  • The idea of returning Spring Street to two-way traffic was originally proposed by Mayor Doug England, during his last couple of years in office. He told me it would be expensive in terms of a traffic study, but the actually changeover would not be that costly.

    It is not an original concept of Mayor Garner.

    Posted by New Alb Annie to Speak Out Loud NA at 6/15/2006 08:42:25 AM

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 7:03 PM, June 16, 2006  

  • Blogtastic,

    To assist you in your understanding of what facts are, here are some facts -Benjamin Franklin (January 17, 1706 - April 17, 1790) was one of the most prominent of the Founders and early political figures, inventor, and a statesmen of the United States.

    Here is an opinion: “As an aside, your historical characterization of Franklin and other pseudonymous and anonymous writers in our early history are both conceptually and factually incorrect.”

    I have read his autobiography and several biographies on Franklin. There is one sitting in my office. I think my characterization was correct. That’s my opinion.

    It’s cool that you want to take down the mayor. Franklin would have been all over that if he thought he was a snake (I think you’ll get the reference). But Franklin associated through and with leaders in the community and did not play with ignorant emotions. He sought to inform the common man, not just sway him. He had depth and substance. One would like to think he would not have stooped to the depths of Swiftboat.

    I hope that you will use your new blog to better illustrate your cause. As far as I can tell you’ve asked a question (great political question because new ideas are truly rare), made a cartoon making fun of the mayor and a logo for a blog. Nothing more than hot air so far. I’m not a fan of the state of NA. Convince me, a self proclaimed rational person, that you have more than just a good writing style (and a passion for correct grammar and spelling).

    You’ve stated you have an agenda, what would you see done? Who would do it? Get it out on the table. Don’t just attack. Franklin had an answer to oppression, the uniting of the states. What’s yours? Please don’t be simplistic and just say get rid of the mayor. You’re being very Rush and NA doesn’t need that right now. Give us some facts.

    Posted by Anonymous to Speak Out Loud NA at 6/15/2006 09:19:46 AM

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 7:08 PM, June 16, 2006  

  • The mission to turn Spring St. into a two-way street is that of a certain "Bookman" looking to increase traffic in his Spring St. location.
    Other than ratcheting up the number of potential customers for Randy, what broader "substantive, positive change[s]" could such an expensive undertaking produce for the city?

    I hope you're not forgetting that it includes several streets surrounding and including Spring Street. Turning two-way traffic will decrease the speeding on these surrounding neighborhood streets. I believe if you get in contact with Dr. Gilderbloom he has the information to back up these statements.

    I, at first, wasn't for this idea thinking that it would only increase traffic, but after looking at study after study saw the many benefits of this undertaking.

    Thanks.

    Posted by ceece to Speak Out Loud NA at 6/15/2006 10:18:34 AM

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 7:09 PM, June 16, 2006  

  • Street reversion:

    Kudos to Doug England for proposing it, to Mayor Garner for understanding its value, and to any future leader with the balls to implement it.

    That leaves out certain reactionaries hereabouts ...

    -Posted by The New Albanian to Speak Out Loud NA at 6/15/2006 10:20:38 AM

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 7:10 PM, June 16, 2006  

  • Yes, it would be good to see somebody actually implement the Spring Street plan instead of just talking about it. It's been what, like 7 or 8 years since I first heard about it.

    Posted by New Alb Annie to Speak Out Loud NA at 6/15/2006 10:31:22 AM

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 7:11 PM, June 16, 2006  

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